28 Comments

Holiday Packs are NOT discounted.

Why do people do it?  Do they hate the parents of a missing child so much that they have to spread rumours on twitter.

Well it seems that way.  Apparently one Facebook group became up in arms over this malicious tweet posted on twitter.  A tweet that was accusing the Find Madeleine site of selling discounted goods, and a tweet that accused the parents of selling the merchandise, designed to aid the fund for searching for their daughter, at “discounted” prices.

Well it started with this tweet:

https://twitter.com/#!/esgeep/status/130398157715685377

Which quickly spread to a Facebook group Justice4Maddie

Did the person stop at that one tweet?  No they went on to do further tweets.

https://twitter.com/#!/esgeep/status/130399259160879104

https://twitter.com/#!/esgeep/status/130399467848470529

If you go to the Find Madeleine site (Screenshot) where the holiday packs are on sale they are NOT discounted, they are still the same price as they were back in 2009.  And this is confirmed not by the McCanns but by a blog that is run by Jill Havern.

So why the need to spread lies?  Why the need to ramp up the hysteria against the McCanns? Why the need to belittle everything they do to find their daughter?

Could it be that some of these people don’t want Madeleine found simply because it would throw their wild theories and accusations, that the McCanns are involved, completely out of the window?

And people wonder why I changed my opinion, it is simple once you start sorting the wheat from the chaff and the lies from the spin.

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28 comments on “Holiday Packs are NOT discounted.

  1. What on earth are they on about?  It doesn’t even make sense.  Discounted what?  What exactly is “Disgusting?”

    Talk about scraping the barrel.  How bloody pathetic.  Made up rubbish again.

  2. I totally agree Sabot.  Scraping the barrel and inventing lies as they do so.  As you can see, from the Facebook comments, people’s refusal to even go and check to see if it was true or not.

    And the worst part is the person who posted the tweet on Facebook didn’t check the facts out, simply because she couldn’t face going on the Find Madeleine site.

    How pathetic is that?  And how malicious?

    • What exactly do they hope to accomplish with this rubbish, Bren, other than to make even bigger fools of themselves?
      No one can understand a word they say most of the time.  And as for checking Facts, we all know that they never do that.

      • Sabot I really think they are trying to rake up the hysteria and the outrage and get people to think the worse.

        Unfortunately, it worked in the past, people believed everything that came out of some people’s mouths…. whether it was true or not, they gained your trust and got you to think they would never lie to you and therefore must be telling the truth, the whole time.

        It is a sad fact, that some people won’t check things out, and will take another person’s word as gospel. 

        But it is things like this that make me angry.  Along with the persistent accusations that because you don’t agree with the torture of Leonor Cipriano you are therefore agreeing to child abuse.

        I don’t know if she is guilty or not, but she did not deserve to be beaten like that.  That is not justice that is bully-boy policing. 

      • The Cipriano Case was an abomination, Bren.  There was never any evidence against her or her brother.  The PJ didn’t even bother to check if the blood in the fridge was Human, let alone Joana’s.
        And yet the screams of outrage when anyone so much as raised a doubt about the case were a sight to behold.  Which on reflection is no wonder.  They were trying desperately to hide what had happened to that poor woman in while in Police Custody.
        I am convinced that she is innocent, and so was one of The Judges who demanded that his opinion be put on record.
        But in any event the conviction was extremely unsafe.  And Gonc and Co should be in prison.

      • No wonder the screams of outrage echoed if they failed to do proper forensics.  Talk about trying to cover up incompetence by the PJ. 

        I know Carana has posted on here a few times about disappearance of Joanna, and queried things about the case.

        Sabot, it you beat someone for long enough and hard enough they will confess to anything in order to stop the beatings….  that is why bully boy policing doesn’t get you results.

      • Sadly, bully boy tactics do get results, Bren,  and innocent people finish up in prison.  And in Portugal some Judges appear to aid and abet this.
        Right from Day One of the McCannn Case the Portuguese Posters knew that Amaral had been made an Arguido in the Cipriano Affair, and they knew that he wasn’t fit  to run a piss up in a brewery.  
        Actually, on reflection a piss up in a brewery was probably the only thing he was fit to run.

  3. Morning Sabot, that is what is annoying me, the way the truth was never told about Amaral.  Do you know what?  I never knew that until January this year.  It was Carana, that provided the link to the paper article showing he was made an arguido the day after Madeleine disappeared.

    We were all being led by the nose to believe that the McCanns were behind the smearing of Amaral, via Metodo3, with relation to the Cipriano case.  When the truth is no way could they have been involved especially as he was made an arguido the day after Madeleine’s disappearance.

    And it is no wonder the British Consul got involved so quick, especially if they knew all about this.  They had to protect their citizens… full stop.

    • We were all led by the nose to believe a lot of rubbish, Bren.  And some of us were a bit more naive than others.
      Personally, I am amazed that it took The British Consul as long as 12 hours to get to PdL  The British Consul knew all about The PJ on The Algarve and about Portimao Police Station in particular.  And Amaral and Co knew that they knew.
      Diplomacy gone mad if you ask me.  We played fair, but they certainly didn’t.
      If anyone was being paid to spread disinformation then it was Portuguese Posters.
      And we now know all about their very dodgy Translations.

  4. Hiya.

    I wish they would go and play some closed circuit online action game or something. At best they are adding distress to the family of a missing child (and anyone else even vaguely connected to the family), at worst they are – at least indirectly – potentially aiding an abductor . And I hesitate about “indirectly”.

    • Morning Carana, well said.  Every word you say is true.  Apart from causing added distress they are ignoring the fact that there is a missing child out there and someone free to abduct another child.

  5. A thought about the Cipriano case. 
    When I was reading about Amanda’s account of the all-night interrogation (bearing in mind she was already exhausted and stressed), she was constantly told that she was either lying or simply couldn’t remember being there. The technique seems to have been to exhaust her even more and then, when in a suitably sleep-deprived confused state of mind, to get her to imagine that she was in the flat with the bar manager and where she would have been if this had happened.  

    She was also told that her boyfriend said that she hadn’t spent the night at his apartment. Apparently, this is not what he said at all: they’d asked him whether he could vouch that she had never left the apartment whilst he was asleep. They had already said that they went to sleep at some point in the apartment, so unless he’d chained her to the bed, how could he say no? It’s a Catch-33 situation: either they spent the entire night awake together (in which case they had previously lied); he had some way of knowing that she couldn’t possibly have left the apartment whilst he was asleep (hint of some kind of kinky situation); or the truth: that no, he couldn’t vouch that she’d been there all night.

    I have no problem imagining a similar interrogation situation (only worse) in the Cipriano case. 

    – Each could have been fed the story that the other had confessed that the other was responsible.

    – The major light-switch for me was whether the brother had been induced to imagine chopping up a body to fit in a fridge. 

    The reconstruction doesn’t seem to have been videoed (or if it was, I haven’t found any trace of it).  The video shown to the court was apparently an “artist’s impression” of what is supposed to have happened based on notes.

    He could have been asked to imagine how to chop up a turkey to fit in the fridge. 

    • I have long felt that the ill treatment of Leonor’s Brother has been vastly under rated, although I suspect that he caved in sooner due to fear of a worse beating than he had already received.  Especially as he apologised to Leonor for the lies he had told about her. This is on record if anyone cares to check.
      I hope someone is defending him.

  6. I’m trying to set aside my personal views. 

    I read  CrazyTony’s post about feedback from a forensic expert re the arm/armpit issue. 

    The feedback seems logical if someone had gone down the stairs head-first (the arms would be out to protect the impact to the head). 

    However, if someone had really simply slipped, they could have gone down on their back… in which case the arms could conceivably have been above the head. However, if that had been the case, I haven’t found images about bruises on the back that could substantiate that scenario.

    Is it possible, or not, that she could have voluntarily thrown herself backwards down the stairs? I.e., with her back to the stairs, hands above her head and injuries to the front of the body? I can’t recall off-hand any case of actual or potential suicide involving a jump in which the person was not facing the void in question. 

    Could an involuntary push whilst her back was to the stairs have accounted for her injuries?

    • It is virtually impossible to injure yourself under your armpit.  That is a kick from a boot while she had her arms above her head trying to protect her head while lying on the floor after having fallen off the glass ashtrays she was forced to kneel on.

      In My Opinion.

      • Sabot, I was a tom-boy kid, climbing and falling off trees and all the rest of it, and I can assure you that it is possible to get bruises anywhere. 

        That said, I find it highly unlikely that the bruise under the armpit was the result of a fall down the stairs if taken in conjunction with all the others.

      • However this occurred, it does indeed seem to be a blow whilst her arms were raised. 

        I’m not a forensic expert. However, I find it totally unlikely that this mark could have been due to a horizontally protruding object during a fall on the stairs as, unless it could have immediately protracted, it would  have scraped the skin upwards.

      • Carana that is what I find unbelievable, there is no skin abrasions just bruises.  Surely falling down stairs you would graze skin as well as cause bruising to yourself.

      • Actually, I have managed a bruise under an armpit. As a kid, I was trying to get down from a tree and was hanging off a big branch, trying to find my footing on a big lower branch. A small branch snapped back and whacked me below the armpit. 

        It is possible, but I can’t imagine how that kind of situation could have occurred in a police station. 

  7. I think I’ve just answered some of my own questions. 

    If she had accidentally fallen down on her back – where are the photos? The major injuries would have been to her back, surely? Wouldn’t she have had head / spinal trauma?

    • Yes Carana, if she had gone down backwards yes, and then her lower body would have gone over her head like a backward flip, due to the momentum so she would have injuries to both back and front.

      And if she had been pushed forwards the chances are she would have needed stitches to her face, or her hands as she tried to stop herself on concrete stairs (which I guess they were).   She would have had more grazes along with bruising.

  8. If she had thrown herself backwards down the stairs, I think we would have been looking at her possibly splitting her head open.  Wouldn’t the jolt of her going backwards meant she would have caught part of her head on a corner of the stairs?

    And if someone falls down a flight of stairs, wouldn’t there be some concern in case she fractured her hip or something, or broke her back?

    I have slipped on stairs a couple of times and ended up on my rear and it is the lower back that gets injured plus where the stair height is.

    • I doubt that many of us have been through bad slippery accidents without a fracture. 

      Anyway, the court did accept that torture had occurred in the case of Leonor. I doubt that her brother would have been treated as a VIP, but I haven’t got to the bottom of that one.

      So far, that means at least one confession under dubious circumstances (I suspect that the brother’s “confession” wasn’t totally above-board, either). 

      So…

      Missing child.

      No proof the child ever got home, let alone any proof that she is dead.

      No videos of forensics or interrogations.

      No proven motive. 

      No proven murder weapon. 

      No DNA. 

      No body. 

      Yet they are serving enormously long sentences????

      On what grounds?

  9. IF she had simply taken a wrong step backwards (ahem), and had slipped on her tummy, her arms would have been all over the place trying to brace the fall. I haven’t seen photos of bruises on her arms. 

    • Most of us that have fallen down stairs, have fallen down wood stair cases at home.  Staircases in police statements are like hospital ones, made of concrete and not very bouncy and not as soft as a set of stairs covered in carpet. 

      Plus you have the fact of the railings which you could also injure yourself on,  but a fall down the stairs I would imagine would give you bruises on both front and back of your body, unless you went down on your bum.  And for her to have bruises on her stomach like she did, shows that she never went down on her bum.

      As for the bruise under the armpit, I slipped once and something dug under my arm pit and that caused a nasty bruise like that, and bruises can appear anywhere when you fall.  

      But the state of her face, to be consistent with a fall down the stairs like that, there would have been cuts and bruises, especially if the stairs were concrete and not covered with any form of floor covering.  

      • Well, even the court admitted she’d been tortured.

        The bottom line that the mother can’t defend from prison is: where is Joana?

      • Another thing… despite all the “confessions” & the  long sentences, neither have been able to provide any indication of where the child’s remains may be (if, indeed she is dead – which doesn’t seem certain, in the least). 

        Now why may that be? 

        Given to a third party? If so, to whom? If not, a bartering point to reduce a sentence? If so, the idea doesn’t seem to have led anywhere.

        Or, just perhaps, they simply didn’t know what happened to the child.

      • Well I think they would have co-operated to get lighter sentences if they were involved.  As you say, perhaps they simply don’t know what happened to that poor child.

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